Bloodlines Mailing List archives May 8-9, 1997
from the John Stewart email list More on the devil and the life of a mailing list, and a Sweetwater concert report slips in ... -REB ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: HELP Date: 97-05-08 From: cnewton@fyi.net (Christopher Newton) What really got my blood boiling was to learn that DeValios is conducting his hideous experimentation in order to learn more about....COLOR BLINDNESS! His morbidly cruel work is making a mockery of scientific inquiry and should be stopped immediately. I urge all reluctant bloodliners to join John and in the letter writing campaign. I am. San Francisco Bay Area bloodliners should also bring this matter to the attention of the Chronicle, Examiner and local electronic media. An effective media campaign WILL stop this needless cruelty. "....Forget the ransom, I think we ought to pants him. Put him on a lead boat in the deep blue sea." Kit Newton ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: the devil Date: 97-05-08 From: ClackClack@aol.com Yikes John- I think you misunderstood me. With the limited info I had how was I to write an "informed" letter? It certainly sounded horrible but if I was going to write a letter that made sense then I would need details. In my job I see letters every day where people are ranting and raving but if they can't make the point with some facts it doesn't do much good. (and they may very well be ignored). Certainly with the additional facts that are now available it is easier to write an informed letter. I didn't doubt you. I did trust you on this one. I know the crap that goes on. I told you about the beagle experiments that went on at Davis when I was there. Cut out their voice boxes so they can't bark or scream. I didn't doubt you, but rather than hootin and hollerin at the moon an informed letter has a much better chance of being taken seriously. Thank you for the additional details. Ron ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Fwd: Re: the devil Date: 97-05-08 From: Angelbravo@aol.com It is I clack who should shoot from the hip. You have every right to want more information. I had all the info and was therefore more insensed. You did not. My apologies. ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Discography Date: 97-05-08 From: Eddie@eddiea.demon.co.uk (Eddie Armstrong) There are a number of JS discographies on the WEb but I haven't seen a complete one with track listing, dates etc - does such a list exist? If not can we collaborate to produce one? -- Eddie _______________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Discography Date: 97-05-08 From: slowcoach@easynet.co.uk (Bob Elliot) I am currently working on a complete discography at my site. It should be ready shortly. Bob Elliot == http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk./~slowcoach/basement/bobs.html ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Sweetwater Date: 97-05-08 From: GeryJarcia@aol.com I took the 1 hour trek across the Richmond Bridge at sunset yesterday (beautiful view, red sky at night), arriving at the Sweetwater for another evening of fine music. John didn't disappoint. The crowd was, as I, rather subdued (long day at work), but very appreciative of the fine performance. John did his 'presentation' about Bloodlines; I gave him my 'Seattle, mister' badge to read the address to the crowd. John, bless his heart, told the crowd that if they had had a card like me they could have joined me before the show running around in my underwear with a ham taped to my forhead... hmmmmmm.....(I thought you promised you wouldn't tell). John mentioned the Pete Seeger tribute album, in which he will join lesser talents such as Springsteen, Jackson Browne and others in doing covers of Pete's works. I'm really looking forward to that one. A local radio station (KFOG) does a lot of live shows, featuring local & national talent, new & classic (ex: Box Set, Steve Forbert, etc), I am going to start sending them e-mail requesting that they recognize the need to air John in this manner. It would be well deserved. If anyone knows any stations that do similar live shows, give it your best shot. Final word on Sweetwater: Sweet! ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Untitled Date: 97-05-08 From: Angelbravo@aol.com Michelle, would you let our friend, who wants to be off the list, know that the CEO mail was from James, who is still in his teens and looking around at the neighborhood. I love the open discussions we get into. It's the stuff of life. It keeps the blood flowing. They're bloodlines. No time to jump ship liberty port ahead. Victory Bravo ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Untitled Date: 97-05-08 From: Angelbravo@aol.com All of you have seen the postings regarding Russel De Valois that have file of all those who have responded. I will keep you appraised of the battle and the shape of our movement. Please let me know at my email address what you are doing and anything you need to know. I'll post, from time to time, how the troops are doing and if we are near VD day. The Line can move back to music and lighter matters. This is not an indication of cessation or surrender. On the contrary. I'm just getting started. It's not about DeValois the man, there will always be a DeValois. It's about what he does to the animals and making sure he can't do that anymore and to send a signal to all those who follow in his path that their days are numbered. Thanks to all those who have contributed crucial information and you who have and will continue to let your thoughts be known about this crime against our friends the animals. God bless and Victory Bravo over. ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: HELP/the devil's web addresses Date: 97-05-08 From: Eddie@eddiea.demon.co.uk (Eddie Armstrong) In message, "David L. Taylor" <davidltaylor5@worldnet.att.net> writes >Dear Bloodliners, > >I am really sorry to read some of the letters regarding Terry's response to >John's call for help on the cruelty to animals at UC Berkeley. Now we are >separated into "Real Bloodliners" and what, "Not Real Bloodliners"? >I was really pleased to find this website so I could hear from others who >love the music from my favorite writer and singer. >I DID NOT join this site to get into bashing people. I also >did not join to start discussions about whether or not CEOs should make >millions of dollars and "what can be done" about them. In the few weeks I've been a member of this group we've run through a wide range of emotions but when feelings run high let's not take them out on each other. A couple of points: 1. We're all Bloodliners and we're here for our shared interest, our love of John's music. Can we keep that our priority? 2. If John wants to enlist our support for any project it must be up to individual members to help or not - and they must be free to choose!!! 3. From the few messages I've seen from Shep I am sure support for John was uppermost in her mind and not being negative about other member. As we all know the inherent difficulties of email communications, can't we at least give each other the benefit of the doubt? 4. For topics such as 'HELP' it would make things easier if they were kept in a single thread and people didn't keep adding different 'subject' headers - this can make it seem as if all our mail is about this one topic. I work in advising people of their rights in the UK including trying to change social policy at Local and National Government level - I'm fighting all the time , hopefully, for a better society. I am glad John takes his stand and I support his stand against animal cruelty but I won't be taking any action in this case as I come to the group to relax. I hope you all can understand and respect that just as I understand those of you who will act and use this group to discuss the matter. We're all bloodliners and if John asks us for something we can choose to help or not but let's not fail to treat each other with care and respect. It's too easy to let our outrage at the actions of a "Devil" overflow into the group. If David chooses to leave that's a shame as he came here to meet people with similar tastes in music and to discuss the same and we should have provided that and we should have made it clear that people were free to take or leave any other subjects we became involved with. -- Eddie ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Chords policy Date: 97-05-08 From: Eddie@eddiea.demon.co.uk (Eddie Armstrong) I saw some messages in this group and in the archives regarding chords for John's songs. Some members seemed to have quite a collection of songs with chords. I am not a sufficiently good guitarist to pick these out myself but would dearly love chords to John's songs. Is there a policy on this - What does John think about it? -- Eddie ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Do we need a FAQ? Date: 97-05-08 From: Eddie@eddiea.demon.co.uk (Eddie Armstrong) As we now have a reasonable number of members wouldn't it be useful to have a FAQ which is automatically sent to new subscribers and available on the Web for the general public. If so what should it contain other than details of this list and Web addresses. -- Eddie ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Life of a Mailing List Date: 97-05-08 From: M.J.Mooney@Bradford.ac.uk (Mike Mooney) Michelle wrote: > >Well, here is is Stewartistas, the day we've all been waiting for. (See >quote from David Taylor below) This is normal in the life of a mailing >list, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. We can look at this in one >of two ways. > >#1 Good riddance... those who can't take the heat, or the flames, or the >content of what people on this list wanna talk about can just unsubscribe >if they don't like it. > >or > >#2 Hmmm. This is a list about John Stewart and his music, for people who >love it and want to "commune" about it. Maybe we should learn from this >little deviation of our purpose and try to get back on track, remembering >that we are all new to this and learning as we go. > >Guess which one I like? > Well, it finally livened up! Generally, I'd agree that we need to show each other a little respect and remember what we have in common. But I'd been thinking for a while that the list had been getting a little (dare I utter a blasphemy?)...dull. Of course, as we're getting lots of new recruits, there are the inevitable intros which trigger us all into the 'what I love about John's music' routines. Great, it's probably the one thing we all agree on. But I think John knows by now that we love him :~), and I think it does no harm at all to dig a little deeper. 'Learn from this little deviation of our purpose and try to get back on track'? Michelle, I think we're right ON track. Remember who started this thread - John Stewart! He's a folk singer, remember? His songs are about real people, real issues. If it was all 'Daydream Believer' and no 'Botswana' or 'Survivors', or [insert your song choice here] he'd just be a pop singer. I was glad to see him raise the animal rights issue, even though I feel (like some other listmembers) that there are some complex issues involved that need exploring further (I was about to say that there's more than one way to skin a cat, but...) And as for James' outrage about the CEOs, *that's* a valid point too; some people might even say that it's the same issue. Incidentally, John's point about money not buying happiness was a good one; but I think James' argument was that it *does* buy food, shelter and medicine - when people don't even have *that*, then talk of happiness becomes a little academic. Politics, politics. (BTW for your further edification I would *strongly* recommend a listen to Iris DeMent's song 'Wasteland of the Free', from her current album. Now *that's* what I call anger. I'd post the lyrics, but they sound much better with the music.) Anyway, my suggestions are: (1) By all means let's widen out the discussions beyond (but not instead of) set lists, banjo strings, favourite songs, etc. (2) If something someone posts offends you, THINK CAREFULLY before sending off a flame - when you can't see peoples' facial expressions or hear their tone of voice, it's easy to read things into emails that aren't there. (3) When threads start getting too involved/off-topic/on folks' nerves, take them off-list to private email. That's the beauty of it, it's easy. Soapbox mode <OFF> Now then, here's a non-controversial topic: John seems to be perceived by his fans (and himself) as a folk singer. But here in the UK, I have *never* seen a Stewart CD in the 'folk' section of the record shops - he's *always* filed under 'country'. Is it the hat, or what? Over to you... Mike M ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Fwd: Re: HELP/the devil's web addresses Date: 97-05-08 From: Angelbravo@aol.com One of the hardest things in life is to take the high ground. Doing what's right is easy, Knowing what's right is hard. I don't feel that Terry's reasoning was wishy washy, I just found it different from mine. I don't like being thought of as a hypocrit and I don't sing what I don't believe in order to be a "groovy guy". I'm glad Terry took the chance of giving me his take on DeValois as it helped me to clarify my thinking and re affirm my commitment. The diversity in our oppinion's makes us the interesting group we are. Yours included. Speaking for myself. I think we might be a little more gentle with each other. I tend to shoot from the hip when I'm passionately involved in a cause. Sometimes I regret it. God speaks to us all a little differently, hoping we'll tell each other. Victory Bravo out. ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Fwd: Patrick's banjo article / the devil/ chat Date: 97-05-08 From: TTillman@compuserve.com (Terry Tillman) Thanks John, I see your point of view also. TT ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Fwd: Re: HELP Date: 97-05-08 From: Angelbravo@aol.com That's the kind of fire that attracts victory. Go get em. ----- Attached Item ----- From: cnewton@fyi.net (Christopher Newton) What really got my blood boiling was to learn that DeValios is conducting his hideous experimentation in order to learn more about....COLOR BLINDNESS! His morbidly cruel work is making a mockery of scientific inquiry and should be stopped immediately. I urge all reluctant bloodliners to join John and in the letter writing campaign. I am. San Francisco Bay Area bloodliners should also bring this matter to the attention of the Chronicle, Examiner and local electronic media. An effective media campaign WILL stop this needless cruelty. "....Forget the ransom, I think we ought to pants him. Put him on a lead boat in the deep blue sea." Kit Newton _______________________________________________________________ Subj: Fwd: Something to think about.. Date: 97-05-08 James, that's just the way the World works. The otherside of theMonkey is, that money seems to have no correlation to happiness. If money was the answer, What is a very over rated commodity? Would you rather make a lot of money or do what you love in life? ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Wow! Date: 97-05-08 From: brookska@dickinson.edu (Katharine Brooks) Hi there. I'm still a relative newcomer to the line and I must say this has been great fun. I have to admit I expected most of the conversation to be about John Stewart but the diversity of discussion has been fascinating. I think what it says is that this is a terrific group of interesting people who have many ideas and interests to share with the world. I am impressed with the thoughtfulness of the e-mails. I had no idea I was with such an impressive group of individuals-- I thought I had just latched on to some Stewart fans :) ! John, you are to be commended for participating in this line- your words, songs, ands deeds are reaching a truly gifted group out here is cyberland. Remember, criticism can be avoided only by saying nothing, doing nothing, and being nothing. As to the seemingly unsolvable problems of animal rights, homelessness, etc., remember what Harper Lee (author of _To Kill A Mockingbird_) said: "Real courage is when you know you're licked before you begin, but you begin anyway and see it through no matter what." Kate Brooks p.s. thanks to all of you who responded with ideas for chords for "Shadows of the Angels' Wings"- I'm still working on it and if I get it together will send them to you. I'll respond to all the private e-mails I received shortly-- May is a busy time in the academic world. Thanks again! ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Life of a Mailing List Date: 97-05-08 From: t_mstrin@qualcomm.com (Merle Stringfield) Hi Mike, John's music is hard to catagorize...thats one of the special things about it. At Tower records in San Diego, CA, one will find CD's of "Bombs away dream babies" & "Airdream Believer" in the Rock/Pop section; "American Folk Song Anthology" in the Folk section; and the cassette of "Airdream Believer" is found in the country section. Must be the presence of Johnny Cash on that one. Merle Stringfield Santee, CA ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Youngsters Date: 97-05-08 From: gburnsid@mcs.dundee.ac.uk (Girvan Burnside) On 05-May-97 MARGIE104@aol.com wrote: >Sorry Michelle...... > >I MUST have been the youngest........at 31......until James arrived > >It's not the age that counts, though, it's the size of the Folk CD >collection!!!!!!!! > >Margie Sorry again but I'm 26 and have been here a few months. Girvan E-Mail: Girvan Burnside <gburnsid@mcs.dundee.ac.uk> ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Devils, Angels, CEOs and Music Date: 97-05-08 From: blasalle@crc-gw.med.utah.edu (GCRC System manager) Devils: To those who are wanting to join the battle on the left coast, you may want to send your feelings and concerns to these folks: Senator Barbara Boxer 1700 Montgomery Street Suite 240 San Francisco, CA 94111 Senator Diane Feinstein 525 Market Street, Suite 3670 San Francisco, CA 94105 and for those of you who surf: http://www.in-search-of.com/frames/government/members/senate/CASR.html Angels: David, I know I'm a little crazy at times... say things that I wish I could reclaim.. for my sake I hope we're all like that once in an while. Consider this: It's not what you're leaving behind, it's what you're taking with you that matters... don't leave. CEO's: James.. keep asking and pushing... you have youth on your side!!! It's hard not to get corrupted by the MONEY game as life goes on (for someone with so little talent I have spent a fair amount of change on guitars).. If you think about it... the way we pay people for what they do is just nuts... so maybe the real question isn't how much you make but what you do with it? MUSIC: saw him in SLC a couple of years ago, it's a good verse and a nice tune- One blue sky above us One ocean lapping all our shores One earth so green and round Who could ask for more And because I love you I'll give it one more try To tell our Rainbow race We're too young to die... - Pete Seeger Lefty out ________________________________________________________________ Subj: what a difference a day makes Date: 97-05-08 From: delausa@mailbox.syr.edu (Del Lausa) I step away from the computer for two days, and all hell breaks loose. As I read the latest messages from all, my replies to earlier messages became irrelevant. I'll take John's advice, and give the list back to the music. All I want to say is that I am grateful any time anyone points to an evil or injustice that i might be able to make a dent in. DeValois is symptomatic. Stopping his specific research practices won't stop the cultural mindset that produced and sanctioned him. It will stop the pain and suffering of a finite number of feeling beings. Silence, as always, is complicity. del ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Outlaws loose and running Date: 97-05-08 From: Loboaw@ix.netcom.com (Steve) So I'm plugged into the net and John's on the CD (Chilly Winds) and I bump into my mail and 31 messages slide in from the Bloodline. Usual email discussion list stuff going on - I've always thought that the internet would prove to be the greatest single block to human understanding we've managed to build so far (somewhere, Satan is giggling over a keyboard [PC, natch, not a Mac]) since it allows us to talk to one another without being with one another. All the stuff that makes us human to one another is missing, the face, the sound, the gestures, the eyes, the smell. All that's left are the words. And words are never all there is. Seems to me, when I do anything seemly, is that if you're on the Bloodliner list, you are, by definition, an outlaw. You've found a chord vibrating in the dark struck by a picker the rest of the world has tried to ignore, and that shared vibration isn't about musicology or banjo neck finger dexterity. It's about something in the heart and soul, embarassing as it is for some of us to admit (me, for a start). Hell, John's not my leader. Don't think he would want to be, if he knew me well, and don't hear him as someone who wants to be for anyone. I don't want a leader-I'm of this country, and I learned a long time ago it ain't up to them. What John is an outlaw with a much better voice than me, so if he's got something to say I want to hear it, whatever it's about. Hell, I might decide he's totally screwed up-comes with being an outlaw (Outlaw = a person in the second half of the 2oth century who gives a damned about something when the norm is to get the running shoe endorsement contract). And I want to hear from the other outlaws, no matter how screwed up they might be (screwed up = any human being who disagrees with the Truth, with <ahem> me). So if someone wants to mount a high crusade against CEOs, oh, hell, let'm take a run at it. I can always delete the string. And maybe I won't. Maybe I'll read. And maybe I'll hear that distant and too damned rare chord, and maybe it'll be time to "ride a panther in a hurricane" again (yeah, I remember him too, and I still miss him, too...). So come on back David, and let's talk about animals, and CEOs, and banjo strings, and love, and war, and chords heard distant in the night. Take care, Steve ps You're not a REAL Bloodliner if you don't ride a Harley (I had to come up with some criteria that I could fit...<g>). -Lobo (AW) off, switches safe... ________________________________________________________________ Subj: "God Speaks" Date: 97-05-08 From: Frgarrett@aol.com John, I've been silent lately. Stunned by the beauty of "Rough Sketches," I guess. Thanks for a great CD. But, your line, "God speaks to us all a little differently, hoping we'll tell each other," could be the quote of the year. If we could all learn to digest that particle of belief, we could understand the world a little better, understand our fellow people better as we stroll down roads, Neon or otherwise. And the people all said . . .Amen. Floyd ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Fwd: Re: HELP/the devil's web addresses Date: 97-05-08 From: TTillman@compuserve.com (Terry Tillman) Thanks John for being another voice of God (or truth, or heart, or self, or whatever name you want to call it... Eddie?). The only means I've found to achieve unity is through diversity--loving, encouraging, honoring, accepting, supporting all the differences and diversity. Thanks for demostrating this once again. Terry T (TT) ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: "God Speaks" Date: 97-05-08 From: PeterB1103@aol.com John's "God speaks . . ." quote -- seemingly offhand -- hit me in the chest too. This dialogue matters, and the diversity of views is important, isn't it? "We're all so curiously alone . . . it's important to keep making signals thru the glass . . ." ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: HELP/the devil's web addresses Date: 97-05-08 From: RTFAL@aol.com Mary: Eddie from the UK. It's geeting worldwide attention. RTFAL ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Something to think about.. Date: 97-05-09 From: alleycat@cruzio.com Hi there young James, I appreciate your outrage about the CEOs, I'm just sorry that you were caught in the crossfire of the DeValois controversy . This is my first Internet experience but I've been told that this sort of thing is quite commonplace among disscussion groups. Do you see what I see in the past few days' messages? I see compassion, courage, intelligence, integrity, honesty, loyalty. It's just that folks all view this from different angles, and that is to be respected: "truth is one, paths are many". Catherine ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Our Guy Date: 97-05-09 From: Bluesy33@aol.com << God speaks to us all a little differently, hoping we'll tell each other. Victory >> ......Artists too........know the burden of leadership........when you're out front...........you get shot at........it's a lonely place to be ............Bluesman out ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: Clack's is back Date: 97-05-09 From: martink@mindspring.com (L. Kent Martin) At 11:35 PM 5/8/97 -0400, you wrote: >Sorry for the bother- or should I say, nedermind the wamdebam? > >Clack's has been restored. I'm breathing easier. > >Ron Praise glory! I had momentary heart palpitations there for a bit. Your site is is a work of art and a true landmark. Thinking we might have lost it gave me considerable pause ... Missouri Bird, Kent ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Devils,Angelbravos,etc Date: 97-05-09 From: RoyFritz@compuserve.com (Roy Fritz) OK, I try to go on a long weekend and... HOLY COW! Well, I've been off line for awhile, so this will be long winded. (Gee Roy, what a surprise!) My three days turned into five, Mister Murphy was along on my trip to the Jersey Shore (Long Beach Island) and the flu finally caught up to me. Chills, fever and other ailments not fit for priimetime Bloodliners. I finally log on and WTFO. 126 e mails. John - I have e-mailed and written Berzerkly, but like Ron, I did need a little more info. This does not reflect on you at all, over the years your ideas have occasionly changed my view of the world, your integrity is obvious in your words, your music, your life. IF (BIG IF here) animal experimentation is sometimes necessary, there is an obligation to treat the animal as kindly as possible else, we could all be guards for the Nazis. After all, 'isn't a life form a life form?' Slightly lighter 'God speaks to us...' That quote is in the Phonenix Concerts book as I noted last week and I hope to have Xerox copies out next week. PHXEROX will be my last publishing venture so for additional copies --- talk to each other. CEOs and big bucks In Boston we'll give Rick Pitino 70 million to coach the Celtics if we're going to talk about weird money - sports - entertainment 10 million to football players 10 times that to basketball players 20 million for the Cable Guy. James - it is a weird old world The trick is to be satisfied within yourself - not always an easy thing. 'Easy money is a hard life baby, all in all' JS Leaving - I don't think I could leave this group of 'Musicologists' even if I strongly disagreed with some opinions. Sometimes the opinion you don't want to hear can change your way of looking at things. Not necessarily to the other person's opinion mind you, but change it. Keep an open mind (but not a hole in your head) John's lyrics have over the years changed my perspectives. We all need to 'lose the mustache and be a little nicer' (OK, some of you guys can keep the mustache) We won't always agree with each other (even about John Stewart) so let's remember sometimes to 'lose the mustache'. Terry and Patrick , thanks for the good input. Michelle - I envy your move, thanks for returning the pics (they were dupes). New Kids (of all ages) welcome. RT 66 - It's out there - waiting. Roy ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Re: On Dr. Devalois Date: 97-05-09 From: martink@mindspring.com (L. Kent Martin) >I have been quite so far on the DeValois issue. < ... > Go for it. And thanks to AB for >bringing this to our attention, even if he is "just a songwriter." > >Patrick >going for it... Whooo-ee! Being off-line a few days (the day job's been a bit manic of late) and trying to catch up this week feels something like coming to the crossing after the Super Chief thundered by: You can spot it roaring off in the distance and marvel at it but you wish you could have been there to see it in all its fury. Love you, Bloodliners, and all your passion and heart! Go for it, indeed! Separately, Patrick, I'm reminded of the recent flap over that one revisionist prof at Northwestern who used the campus Web site to spew his dischords about the Holocaust. In the end, public outcry shut him off. Let's all go for it. Missouri Bird, Kent ________________________________________________________________ Subj: Update : John Stewart UK Fan Page Date: 97-05-09 From: slowcoach@easynet.co.uk (Bob Elliot) Hi Omaha Rainbow issue 13 (John Stewart content) now online at Bob's Basement. Bob Elliot == http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk./~slowcoach/basement/bobs.html ________________________________________________________________ end of Bloodlines archive May 97(F) Back to the archive menu